Comments on: Two easy ways church can shape the culture

By: Jason_Robertson

Jason_Robertson — Fri, 08 May 2009 22:04:11 +0000

Did you mean to ask "What went right?"
Because every century since the Puritans has been greatly impacted what those people did in their generation.
What would America be like had it not been for the Puritans?
What Atheist/Communist/Barbarian would be ruling a united Europe had it not been for Christianity's cultural (even political) influence?
Where would the world be economically?
What status of life and liberty would women enjoy?
What would have happened to the Liberation Movement had it not been for cultural-transforming power of the Gospel?
What if all countries would have been like China or India or Korea or the Soviet Union?
Where would education be today; where would the arts and sciences be today; where would be philosophy without the great Christian thinkers?
What if Europe would have never had the Westminster Assembly or if America would have never had Christianity reflected in its laws, politics, and policies?

So the question is "What went right?"
Followed by "What lasted?"
and "What can we do better?"

By: Scott Christensen

Scott Christensen — Fri, 08 May 2009 21:48:39 +0000

Are the 17th century American Puritans a good example of carrying out this cultural transformation? If so, what went wrong?

By: Jason_Robertson

Jason_Robertson — Wed, 06 May 2009 05:37:34 +0000

Stephen Um says: All peoples, institutions, and groups are interested in changing, renewing, or transforming society by impressing their core values on the culture. For that matter, we cannot help but make an impact on our culture. The minute anyone opens his mouth, he is speaking in a particular language, from a particular cultural context, with a particular worldview vision of morality and various definitions of what he believes to be the "true", the "good", and the "beautiful." As such, no one should be led to think that he is not "getting into the public square." In addressing the question, "Is it the church’s responsibility to embrace or assume the civic responsibility of the state (e.g. education, the poor, social injustice, the arts, etc.)?", we need to consider the following. The church does not have any juridical authority in the city/state public square, but that does not mean that the Church ought to stay out in the periphery. The church does have the responsibility for acts of mercy and for engaging our community with acts of social justice (cf. Jas. 1.27). Paul states that "as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, especially to those who belong to the family of believers" (Gal. 6:10). He is clearly referring to a deed ministry that should be shared with all people as they have need. James says that true religion is this: "to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world" (Jas. 1.27). In other words, it is the church’s responsibility to pursue both public compassion and personal piety. For example, although a failing school system is not the civic responsibility of the church, the church could get involved in "doing good" by perhaps coming along side of the local school in providing after-school tutoring. Unfortunately, some activist or fundamentalist groups have thought that they should either assume the responsibility of the state (whether conservative or liberal) or impede the government’s involvement in the lives of individuals. However, the gospel calls individuals in the church to pursue the common good in our culture and to enter into the public square by encouraging and promoting gospel values and by engaging in an incarnational/grassroots strategy for cultural renewal and community development. This is not to suggest that social action, political involvement, or pursuing the common good is a replacement for evangelism. What does this gospel response look like? There is to be an integration of faith and vocational calling in bringing cultural renewal. Thus, the church and its members should cultivate friendships with people in their neighborhoods, join clubs and associations, and partner with organizations that are also involved in acts of mercy and social justice. In other words, because the ministry of the gospel is both a ministry of word and deed, we can actually promote the public witness of the gospel by pursuing the common good and engaging in acts of social justice. [Stephen Um is the senior minister of Citylife Presbyterian Church in Boston, Massachusetts. ] ___________________ go here for more quotes on 9Marks about this issue. ||here

By: David Paul Regier

David Paul Regier — Wed, 06 May 2009 05:27:23 +0000

Jason, my eyes are bleeding from reading all the material.

All you needed was one verse. Matt. 28:19 says to go and make disciples of all nations. Of, not in.

God gives that directive to His church. He never implies that we are not to fulfill it, or that he will give us a pass. His expectation, and His promise (Gen. 28-14: in Abraham's seed, all the families of the world will be blessed) is that this will be fulfilled.

And yes, it does happen soul by soul, household by household. But His disciples turn the world upside down (Acts 17:6).